|
So now because he did the same traverse without a hold he has 2 8Cs?! To me it just seems like he wants a better combined score.....
2006-06-13 @ 01:44
|
|
Oh come on! Dani is arguably one of the finest climbers in the world and because he merely posts his climbs into this database, you are ready to paste this sort of accusation on him?!? That makes no sense, man.
2006-06-13 @ 02:20
|
|
Well, yea the whole "arguably" is what I like to take part in. Considering how much is allways happening on this site not much is said, so I figure I would speak my mind. I do have my reasons. First he has tried at least two other 9a+ routes and failed. I believe I read on desnivel.com that he fell 300 times on La Rambla Extension, and his good friend Hector Del Campo said he fell 100 times on it...either way that is alot of attempts. Chris Sharma fell 27 times on Realization and Ramon did La Rambla in 50. He has climbed 2 problems of supposedly the same difficulty in a month for both of them while at the same time establishing 9a's and 8c+s so forth. You say what I said makes no sense? This makes no sense. In addition establishing a climb is even more difficult, Dani had the beta for both Realization and saw Ramon on La Rambla. Yet he sent neither....from descriptions of his routes he seems to like endurance yea? Both these climbs are very endurance oriented(I think??) It is not like the Fly or anything. If he can link a 8c+ into an 8c to make an 9b(what he orignaly graded it, now 9a+) why can he not link a very often quickly sent 8c+ (3 tries for David Lama, 1 day for Ramon) into a 7C+ boulder probelm? especially if he can do 3 8Bs in three days? To me this does not add up. The routes of his that have been repeated have all gone very very fast, 2nd try, 4th try, 10th try, mutltiple peoples first 8c+ redpoint ever, on his routes. El Koala an 8c has been flashed by a 15 year old(OK I admit he is mega mega good, but still 8c Flash isn't easy) and Mrazek also flashed it and commented that Dani's 8c was more like a 8b/8b+. There are so many things Dani could repeat quickly even within spain to prove he is the caliber climber to climb to 9a+ in a month, even in Spain; Iñi Ameriketan, Il Domani......I just see that Dani is claiming to be a better climber than Patxi, Ramon, Graham, Sharma, Mrazek, McClure, Yuji....This erks me because I do not believe that he has shown a reliable record of routes stronger than these other big names, Hell Richard Simpson drops by and send one of his projects and calls it 5.14c/d and that was a route Dani didn't send. And now he is claiming 2 V15s and 3 V13s in 3 days....putting his name along side Nicole, Graham, Zangerl, Koyamada....I feel bad saying this but I feel it is true, honestly I would be happy if he went out to Britain and repeated McClure's routes or sent Realization, or Dreamtime. But he hasn't.
2006-06-13 @ 03:20
|
|
And I thought it's all about fun...
2006-06-13 @ 04:13
|
I do not think climbing can be about one thing.
2006-06-13 @ 07:03
|
|
It would be nice to have replies from Andrada himself !
2006-06-13 @ 10:32
|
Climbing is all about fun when you climb for yourself, once you go on sites like this one and if you're first in the ranking you got to be a minimum serious, and when you earn your life with climbing you got to be honest, it becomes like a 'job'.
I quite agree with James, I don't say Dani hasn't done the routes trav or boulders because I can't prove it but there is one thing that isn't ok. Like James said, Dani only does hard routes that he put's up, he rarely does routes with an already existing reputation about the grade. Other thing that bothers me is that almost all the 9a route Dani established et that were reapeted have been downgraded, that means maybe all his 9a's are 8c+'s witch would make more sense according to his attempts in realization or la rambla, like 'el intendo' he did the FA ramon downgraded, 'Estado critico' I personnaly know 2 climbers who say the route is maximum 8c+, anyways, for almost all his 9a's he says 8c+/9a, then why does he always rate them 9a on his scorecard? Only to have more consideration of the climbing community? For my part it's absolutely not the way to get that
2006-06-13 @ 11:56
|
I also agree with james but more with jerome.
I have seen dani andrada several times climbing outside and he was so far away to be the best climber i saw.
1st time at petzl roc trip in Cantobre where he didn't send nothing really hard(up than 8b).But i saw him trying many 8a+ onsight or 8b or whatever and he looked so bad as if the routes were very hard. So i though dany wasn't so good but then i saw one month later that his scorecard was more than impressive.
Ten 9a or harder in one year, nearly only FA and always in the commentary:8c+/9a...So that means those 9a's are 8c+ hard or 9a easy...If dany climbs only for his pleasure and not for his scorecard he would have graded 8c+, not 9a...what does he wanna prove?
Look...He can do 8c boulder, he can onsight 8b+, can do five 9A's or harder in two months but he can't do realization or rambla? What that means? realization and rambla should be graded 9b or 9b+?
I saw dani at céuse and during one month he has just done 2 8c and one 8c+?!(ok that's very good but when you see on his scorecard what he is able to do...)
This is Here that there is NO SENCE!!
We'll learn more about him at petzl roc trip 2006 if he comes...
2006-06-13 @ 12:57
|
|
I will be the first to admit my ignorance to all of this, but I guess that I would have expected to hear of it sooner.
2006-06-13 @ 13:03
|
|
Writing just to point that "Estado crítico" was FA by Ramonet not Dani. The route was graded 9a by Ramonet.
2006-06-13 @ 16:01
|
|
and it was downgraded by Nicolas Favresse and Edu Marin if you want names
2006-06-13 @ 17:41
|
|
Well guys!
If you really do care so much about Andrada's ticks you should climb
the routes you talk about and then come back with accurate grades? Or
simply try to avoid speculations about what other people climbs and use
all that energy to climb more...
2006-06-13 @ 23:47
|
|
We can not allways be climbing and especially when training hard like on a campus board rest is very important, so when we rest some people like to be involved in discussions about the people who are the face of our sport, they represent us, so I at least find it may reflect badly on climbing if our forerunners are overly motivated by sponsor pleasing and "fame". I find it annoying when people say "Well why don't you blah blah blah" Because guess what we are not talking about our climbing abilities, moron.....
2006-06-14 @ 00:05
|
|
what i see is lot of people talking and almost no experience in climbing, how can someone say that if he doesnt climb realization or rambla all the other routes are not the grade he gave...
i'm sure that a guy with 10 8a's would'nt do every 7b+ he would try we are talking about the maximum level near the physical limit is so easy not to do a route on this level for things like a mental block, or a lack of will. a guy like Andrada puts up undreds of routes a year is normal that he gets more motivated with is own routes than trying other people stuff that most of the time are far from home. who never been in catalunya hard projects are everyhere for each route of 8c+ or harder that dani does there are other 5 or 6 that stay there and some of them are even easier but thing like the quality of the route, the imagination of the climber and his motivation can leave a 8c for project for several years and things get even harder with the pass of time routes get dirty and old and people loose will to try them. the route that Simpson did his in a very bouldery sector, a route like that can be impossible or 9a only depending on the imagination of the climber and this doesnt say who is the best cause in another route the same climbers could not find the sequence another would.
people should not peek on Andradas sends only by his send of other people routes he sets up routes and climbs them he climbs every day of the here his motivation is quite diferent from climbers that stay indoor all winter and then go for a route on a forgeiner country, if you'ld climb 365 days on rock and majorly seting up new routes or onsighting what would be your motivation to stay under a route like action direct, or hugh several days i can understand why he doesnt try many other people stuff or even goes out of his country/area, he has the best crags, the best rock and he can stay the rest of his life putting up new and hard stuff... give him credit
2006-06-14 @ 01:54
|
I can understand where you are coming from saying that he has no need or desire to go out and climb other routes if he has his own. But the problem is that he is claiming some of the hardest routes in the world. This seems to me like he does want some attention, he does want people to see him as a great climber. If he was just out bolting cliffs and climbing purely for fun, he would not rate all his climbs or even report them, like Sharma. So then going with the assumption that he wants to be seen as great because he is constantly reporting the Hardest climbs, climbing all FA is not the way to prove that you are strong, that is the problem I see. It would be fine to just chill in your own area climbing, or it woudl be good to go out and test/show your mettle internationally. But Dani is claiming to be the best off of nothing but his FAs. Yes he can climb some 8c+ s for sure which means he is great but it does make him better than all the people he is claiming to be better than. If you do not count FA his best have been 5 8c+s over 2 years.
2006-06-14 @ 02:40
|
|
James I apologize if you felt attacked, it wasn't my intention.
What I meant is that you claim that Andradas routes can't possibly be
so hard just becouse two of his routes were downgraded and he did'nt
climb a couple of 9a+. Do you really think these facts are
enough? If you read in Escalar and Desnivel (www.desnivel.com)
you'll find some more info. Most of Andradas hardest routes are still
unrepeated, even when guys like Ramonet, Hirayama, Usobiaga and other
have tryed.
Even if the guy is overgrading, say 1 or 2 +grades, his scorecard would
still be an impressive record (at least a couple of 9a and a bunch of
hard 8c+ in quite a short period of time). I guess this is the same
effect as with other top climbers proposing hard grades in the past, we
will not get the right info until some people climbs the routes.
2006-06-14 @ 09:56
|
|
yeah having done 6 9a's or 6 8c+'s is really different, like said before many of his route were downgraded and all his 9a's almost are 8c+/9a, why does he all put them like 9a's? A humble person would at least balance, I find this ridiculous really but like James said guys like andrada are the image of our sport so yes sometimes I do care about what he says or does. And thingd like Romain said that at the Roc trip he was far from the other climbers is really strange for a guy 'able' to do two 9a's and one 9a+ in less then one month
2006-06-14 @ 10:30
|
We don't say that dani isn't strong, he is strong definitly but i think that you, carlos, doesn't know what is an 9a+ or a 9b and me too and i think that there is not a lot of pupil who can say if it is 9a or 9a+ or 9b...Like you said it can be hard psychologically and so you'll maybe think that the route is more 9a+ than 9a so it's pretty hard to decide and that's maybe why dany put in comments:maybe 8c+ or maybe 8c+/9a...So why does he put 9a???
I 'vce climbed during 2 years with gerome pouvreau and one, week end,in two days he has made 2 projects...They were graded 9a for both. I belayed him in his first 9a and he used to think very hard that he couldn't do one mouvement, but he crashed it but when he went down he didn't say: oh great i've done a 9a!!!i'm so happy to do 9a!!! he just said that he was very happy but he prefer saying that the route is 8c+ and not 9a just because he is modest, he climbs for his pleasure and he has nothing to prove outside...Rockclimbing isn't competition...But now with climbers like Dany or anyone else it's worse than a competition...Someone said 9a, so i'll do a route which is 9a+...
A bit like another spannish guy, i don't remember his name, but every body knows it because he said he has done the 9b+........And 7 years ago aproximatly when 9a wasn't as common as now, he said that he did a 9a...
Don't tell us that it is normal, that everything is alright, i just tell what i see. And maybe dany is very strong in his route but when i said that if dany can climb 8c boulder, 8c+ traverse, 9a+ routes, 8b+ on sight, etc. why at meetings like petzl rock trip climbers like Gerome pouvreau who has never made 8c boulder, never made 8b+ onsight(just 8b/B+ flash), never made officially 9a are really really really stronger than Dany?
Don't tell us that it is because dany can't climb as well as at home because the aim of meetings like that is discovering a new cliff so it's the same for EVERY BODY...
Then to answer Fred, i'll say again that when a climber is able to do several 9a+ and 9a in just 2 or 3 months why does he fall more than 300 times in La rambla?
Ok maybe a mental block but i don't think so. Then when you do ten 8a or something like that, you can do every 7b+....For exemple i used to be quite strong for my age( two 8b+ first try at 16, several 8b's, etc.) but this year i 've stopped climbing during several month because i couldn't train more and now i start climbing again and i still do 7c or 8a or more when i'm better!
Maybe it's not the same when the level is up than 9a but when you do a first Ascent, you must grade a demi degrees down than the degree you think the route is...like if it's a 9a, you must say 8c+, in order to be not pretencious...Because if david lama try and do dany's 9a on sight and said that it's 8c+, what the world will think about Dany???
we'll see that in 1 year i think^^ lool
2006-06-14 @ 19:21
|
|
Of course you all have a point. It seems likely that Andrada has been a
bit otimistic when grading his own climbs. On the other hand we see in
almost each other scorecard that people claims ascensions to be soft
but they register them as the harder grades (why).
It will be interesting to see if Andradas 9a an harder routes will keep
the grades he proposed.Just don't bother too much and climb as much as
you can.
I personally am more impressed about climbers like Gerome P, Charlotte
D or David L than other "big" names. The new generation seems to have
found the point between climbing really hard and having fun.
2006-06-14 @ 20:39
|
I haven't read everything about this topic, but I would like to do a short comment about Dany Andrada partcipation to Petl Roc Trip 2004 in Cantobre... to bring another "lightning"...
He and his friend Pedro Pons arrived two days later after everyone (tired from climbing somewhere else...) and they finished third at the FlashContest http://fr.petzl.com/petzl/SportNews?News=64 !! Beeing there, only for two days ! Not so bad, no ?
From memory, I think there were about 18 routes to try onsight of flash...and they did most of them so ! (Gérome Pouvreau is not on the Top 3 for this part of the contest).
Ask organisation Couleur Caillou for the list of routes they flashed/onsighted to be honest and sure... ( http://membres.lycos.fr/cafmillau/). But does it really matter ?...
2006-06-15 @ 01:10
|
|
NAZKAGARRI! ERASOALDI!
2006-06-15 @ 03:36
|
Just like to point out that when other "super strong climbers" do and downgrade a FA by Dani is when we might thing "he was overgrading", but we must consider that we usually never know or have info when these "super strong climbers" try a FA put up by Dani and fail, so please, try to be more open minded... I personally know of some of the "super strong climbers" having tried FA by Dani in Santa Linya that they considered of another galaxy, but of course, no publicity on that.
Also, in Santa Linya the rock is sometimes so soft that small edges can end up in considerably huge jugs and consequentally downgraded as ascents go on.
2006-06-15 @ 08:56
|
To answer Carlos, it can be hard or soft for a same grade, without meaning it's a different grade ! I sometimes propose soft grade because I was in a good day when I did the climb, and I didn't feel it so hard. But when I come on 8a, and when I see that tens of climbers graded it with a "+", I feel it would be pretentious to lower the grade only because I was in a good shape.
About Dani, indeed it's difficult to have an opinion on a single event : Rom, as you mention G. Pouvreau, remember that last year he couldn't climb 7b at Céüse after the WC. A few days later he did 8c+ I think around Nice...
About Dani's opinion, maybe the following article could be interesting, but my Spanish is so poor. Could someone help us ?
http://www.desnivel.com/deportes/escalada_en_roca/object.php?o=14821
2006-06-15 @ 09:10
|
|
It seems
that as time goes by, the same old questions arise in the same old way.
The point is always about believing or not that something has been
made a route, and believing or not that the grade is really the
proposed one. This happened with Gullich and Action Directe, that once
nobody else
than Gullich did it was pointed out as an "hard 8c+" and that since
some people started to climb it is now believed to be the proposed
grade 9a. Sometimes also the opposite happens, sometimes the grade is
really lowered.
The problem with 8a.nu is: who cares if somebody claims something that
is not, being he honest or not? The answer is simple. The
ranking. Why Andrada registered the routes as 9a even is he thinks that
some of them could be 8c+? First because probably he thinks so, and
then in order to get more points, just in case they were in effect 9a.
This does not happen only with FA, but also with established routes.
Even with the (much) lower ones I'm facing by now. If I make a route
that other people
graded 7a and feel it 6c+, should I be so honest or pretentious or even
stupid to get 50 points less?
As Carlos said, people claims
ascensions to be soft, or "maybe easier.."
but they typically register them as the harder grades. The reason is
typically to get the same points the others got by the route.
And
if I really feel it is 7a+, should I say it and seem to be hunting for
points? Stating that an undergraded route is harder than what a guide
(or some others) reports can place you in a bad position, even if you
are completely honest.
The point is simple: if two of us made the same route, why should
we get different points? But at the same time, if two of us made the
same route and felt different grades, why not saying so?
I think that a given route should give a
given amount of points, no matter who climbs it and what grade he thinks the route is (obviously unless the route
physically changes for some reasons).
Everybody should be able to
propose his own grade, climbing is really subjective. But the average grade
should be
used to derive the points. I think that this would help in many ways. The ranking
would be more objective, and people would be more opened in proposing
his grade.
Let's take a FA by Andrada with a proposed grade of 9a. If
somebody else climbs it and thinks it's 8c+ then voila', Andrada gets
less points. If nobody can make it, then maybe it's really 9a, and then
let Andrada keep it's points. Yes, at these levels it takes time, but
what I've always found more interesting was the "All time ranking", and
sooner or later the route will be repeated. And after all, if Andrada
can open so many hard routes in such a few time, either somebody else
can climb them in the same few time or he is so strong that for the
year the routes give him points I think he has right to keep them.
It would be also nice to derive the average grade
of a route based on the level of the climbers that made it, giving more credit to those
climbers that are nearer to the proposed grade and less to those that are much over or much under it.
I can easily guess that what I propose is not so simple, first for technical reasons and then for
a practical use of the website. But I think it is worth a little
thinking, if not for all the routes at least for some that are very famous or very frequently repeated.
2006-06-15 @ 11:33
|
|
ok, I never post on these things and don't usually read them, but I had to write something about this. First of all, Dani is not claiming to be better then anyone. He is merely registering his routes/boulders with the grades that he thinks are appropriate. I doubt if you went up to him he would tell you that he is better then Dave Graham or Patxi or anyone else. If any one of you has a problem with his routes, try and go do them, and then see what the correct grades are. So far there has been so much criticism of Dani's routes, yet I do not see a repeat of any of his 9a's or 9a+'s. It's funny that as soon as a Spanish climber puts up a route harder then 9a, he gets critisized and people say he should repeat one before he can put one up of the grade. But when Dave Graham puts up a 5.15a, no one says anything. Dave has failed on Realization just like Dani has, so why is it OK for him to put up a 5.15a but not for Dani. People like James have never seen Dani climb, or seen him in a video, or even met him, just base their opinions purely off of his scorecard. The same goes for Fred Rouhling and whoever put up Chilam Bilam. People are always saying these routes are soft and overgraded, yet no one has repeated them, and I'm sure people have tried. So until someone repeats Dani's 9a+'s or 8C's or whatever, dont give him shit about what you, sitting in front of your computer 3000 miles away from his route, think of the grade.
2006-06-15 @ 19:30
|
Alright, i've maybe said the contrary of you Gabor, but it wasn't my meaning.
The thing that i reproach to Dani is for exemple he has done several 9a and most of them are FA.Then in the commentary he always puts:"think 8c+ hard" or some stuff like that!
So why? why does he grade them 9a if he thinks that it is a less easier?
It's his right for sure but i don't like this kind of spirit.
Then to ask Laurent Zoutte i totally agree with you, but dani didn't make any 8b+ on sight or 8b on sight and gerome didn't do the flash contest, he just tried the ultimate route and he missed winning because at first try he did the first part, arrived at the big rest and before starting climbing up he just said:"ok take me i just want to see the next part" because he though that he was able to make again this "first part" but he never did it again that's why he is only 3rd....(i precise that he was the only climber to do this 1st part graded 8b/b+ at first try).
Then you can't compare dani and dave first because dave has "only" made 1 9a+ and dani has made more than 10 routes in 9a in one year so....
And dave has also repeated bain de sang at second try which is 8c+/9a, and has repeated action direct 9a very very fast(the fastest), and also did Hasta la rambla 8c/c+ at 1st try or 2sd try at 16 years old so we know the capacity of dave and we are not surprised of what he can do.
But when you see climbers from nowhere who annouced 9b+ for a route....Don't tell us that it's just because he is spannish that we accuse him!!!^^
2006-06-15 @ 20:46
|
just to modify my last post i've written some mistakes^^:
first here:"Then to ask Laurent Zoutte i totally agree with you, but dani didn't make any 8b+ on sight or 8b on sight " i wanted to say "then to answer(not to ask)[...]8b+ on sight or 8b on sight at the petzl roc trip*
sorry for the double post but i can't edit my last one to correct my self..
2006-06-15 @ 20:50
|
I agree with Roms and figure I should state it as well. This has nothing to do with Dani being Spanish, it has to do with a huge number of high level FAs without many nonFA hard routes. I do not doubt things that Patxi does.....I would tend to believe a Dave Graham 9a+ because he has done sooo many other hard routes, and tends to downgrade things even. He calls Slashface(V14) hard V12, sent Esperanza(V14) 2nd try on a rest day....So when he says he linked a V13 into a V11 into a V12 into a V6 arete topout on a huge boulder I would believe that those are some really hard boulder problems if Dave's V13s are harder than some V14 seems like 5.15a easy.
2006-06-16 @ 01:59
|
|
this is all true, however this still doesnt answer one thing. James's point on why Dani shouldnt be able to grade his routes 9a+ is because he has tried other 9a+'s and failed. However, so has Dave Graham. So why does his 9a+ recieve no doubt at all, yet Dani's automatically gets called soft. True, Dave repeated a couple 9a's, but Id say no nore then 3 or 4 at most. Dani has also repeated some 8c+'s and maybe a 9a, so they are not as far apart as they seem. But my point still remains... until someone repeats Dani's routes and downgrades them, he is innocent until proven guilty.
2006-06-16 @ 03:52
|
|
also, answering Roms point, he does put the higher grade when its a slash grade 8c+/9a, but whatever thats his decision, a lot of people do that.
2006-06-16 @ 04:19
|
Dave Graham has 19 confirmed 8c+s Dani has 5........ And around 17 8c's to Daves 30....
Not to mention the fact that two of Graham's 9a's went 3rd try, and Action Direct with no specific pocket training.
I dunno I just originally said it was crazy Dani now has two V15's off of one traverse....
2006-06-16 @ 04:50
|
|
And I guess the fact that he thinks the traverse is 5.15a/b. If he can climb 5.15a/b sooo fast why can't he repeat other 5.14d routes?!?!
2006-06-16 @ 04:52
|
What is 8a crew opinion ?? You took position on many issues, but this time you remain quiet.
As soon as there are ratings, there is a competition, and competition can't be as fun as a game. If Dani just wanted to "merely register" his ascents, he would have made a log book instead of a scorecard !
We shifted to a comparison between climbers. The initial question was not to say if X is better than Y, but more widely about credibility of the best climbers in the world, where a "+" makes a huge difference. Some climbers prefer discovering new crags and making first ascents, some prefer the classical hard routes... The fact is that almost all best climbers obtained their credibility FIRST by repeating old standards - such as R. Simpson, whose FAs are credible because he repeated really hard stuff. Repeating a few 8c+ has nothing to see with 2 or 3 well established 9a (and Bain de Sang is not among these...).
All climbers can make mistakes, even the best. Some prefer not to grade their FA. In my opinion it's better to propose a grade, but with many precautions and objectivity. Is it your case, Dani ?
2006-06-16 @ 09:55
|
Sorry, James, but if you are doing your statistics based upon the 8a.nu records, you are pretty far from being right. The figures you are providing corresponds to the period of time in which Dani has been reporting ascents to the site. However, Dani's been climing for a lot of years (most of them at a high level) and he has REALLY a bunch of 8c+ which are not FAs. Don't know exactly the numbers but I guess that Dani has sent much more confirmed 8c+ than the vast majority of the high level climbers.
Taking into account the well known examples of suspicious on inflated grades that has been almost forgotted in the case of other climbers (see Hidrophobia, or Bain the sang f.i.) it makes me curious what is the reason for such a strong reaction against Dani's performance.
Even if the case whith Dani is that he is inflating all the grades of his FAs (which, BTW, is still to be demonstrated as far as only few of them has been repeated and downgraded) it does not demonstrate in any way that he is acting in bad faith. Moreover, I personally believe that he is convinced of the grades he is proposing. As far as I know he has been alway honest in that sense, and was well known in the past as a terrible "sandbagger". Maybe now he has lost the focus on his grade proposals (and I repeat that it is still to be proven) but I am pretty sure that he is doing his best when it comes to grading.
2006-06-16 @ 14:48
|
I can't help commenting on the subject. I think that the 8a.nu is a really nice thing for the climbing community. You can get some statistics quite easily on most routes in the world. However, there are problems with using the site for grading:
1. Not all strong climbers are registered.
2. You don't log when you have missed an attempt at a route.
3. If you grade differently from the "accepted" one, you will likely get a "sandbag" or "scorecard-hunter" label.
This means that the statistics will inevitably be wrong.
And lastly, grading is not an exact science (even if I agree with Morten Gulliksen's ideas about trying to make it more exact). An 9a for Graham might be an 8c for another Andrada and vice versa, without there being something wrong with the grading of the route.
Cred to Andrada and Roulhing and all other strong climber ;-)
2006-06-16 @ 15:36
|
|
<< If Dani just wanted to "merely register" his ascents, he would have made a log book instead of a scorecard ! >>
Possibly: but making a logbook doesn't give you the nice pyramid
graphics and stuff. I tried to use a logbook instead of a scorecard and had to switch back.
As another poster mentioned, many strong climbers aren't on the
site. In general the ranking shouldn't be taken so seriously. People
are just getting worked up over Dani's scorecard because they are
taking the whole thing too seriously.
Also:
the rules for 8a's ranking system are pretty weird. Giving less
points for freepoints is nonsense (and how are you supposed to register
a
freepoint onsight?). Adding 30 points for "Trad" is one of the
most ridiculous things I've ever heard of (if you want to rank trad
ascents, you need to use E grades or something that takes danger into
account). So relax about it: the rules don't even make
sense---the ranking is meaningless and just for fun.
Maybe he registers his 8c+/9a's as "9a" because he thinks they are
closer to 9a than to 8c+. He has some "8c/+" routes registered at "8c", so he
does not always go with the higher grade.
Maybe 8a just needs to let people register routes as slash grades and the whole controversy will disappear. ;-)
2006-06-16 @ 17:01
|
|
One other point is that with modern very long boulder problems, as well
as very short sport routes, having a seperate ranking for routes and
boulders doesn't really make sense.
Not to mention that there are weird hybrid situations in modern
climbing (Akira was mostly bouldered, and then the last 7-10m done
with a rope).
The combined ranking is a cool idea, but it doesn't really work
accurately because it is harder to get points in the bouldering ranking
than the route ranking. This means that the route ascents
contribute disproportionately to the combined ranking.
2006-06-16 @ 17:13
|
|
James O'Connor is my bitch. Oh and Chris Sharma would flash that shit...
2006-06-16 @ 21:29
|
|
Dani doesn't training to win somebody.. Dani only say his opinion/grade that his rotpunks.
All people that have comented this new don't have any idea that how is Dani.. Less talk and more climbing!! fuckYOUbabyes
2006-06-17 @ 00:53
|
|
I don't think I want to understand......Hey, I climbed for 6 straight hours today and 7 yesterday, doesn't mean I can't spend 3 min writing shit on 8a.nu
2006-06-17 @ 05:16
|
|
Easy fellas. Lets settle this on the rock. Anyone want to fly me to Spain. I'll try Dani's routes!
2006-06-18 @ 07:49
|
|
Does anybody know what his new "1 fragmento" "2 y 3 fragmento" "3 y 4 fragmento" boulder problems are? I am hopefully wrong but I just had a feeling they are pieces of the big traverse.....
2006-06-18 @ 21:45
|
|
okay Im gonna have to agree with Gabor on this one. yes, Dani is strong and the grades of the routes he does are HIS OPINIONS. I dont see any american on here going over to Spain and repeating any of his routes so settle down. Grades are guidelines for climbing and shouldnt be taken seriously unless you stress to much and worry about your sponsers dropping yuou. if that's the case, stop climbing. and Dave can put up a 9a+ and no questions it because he's well respected and has done s slew of 8c+s and a couple9as like Gabor said. I think that Dani has the right to claim the 9a+ grade because he's a top climber and climbs harder than anyone on 8a. I think that claling his route soft and not actually haveing climbed it or tried it is way out of line.
2006-06-18 @ 23:29
|